tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post1306425052861871849..comments2023-07-15T05:32:20.508-07:00Comments on Frontiers of Zoology: Dead Bunyip Preserved in OutlineUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-86443552003784993322012-09-18T16:25:13.751-07:002012-09-18T16:25:13.751-07:00Once again I do not have the option to reply-to-a-...Once again I do not have the option to reply-to-a-reply. The short answer is that known animal candidates are always preferable to made-up ones. If you are advoxating a protosirenian which has by convergence acquired the outline of an Elephant seal, that is one thing that I have heard about before: but the trouble is it is unnecessarily convoluted. And in this case we not only have other similar depictions from the same general area, we do have a series of visual sightings to go on, tracks, and even a few clear photographs. The photos show an elephant seal beyond any shadow of a doubt<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-68111529939604310902012-09-18T13:00:04.479-07:002012-09-18T13:00:04.479-07:00I did look at the object! And, I think it just as... I did look at the object! And, I think it just as plausible that the carving could be of a proto-sirenid that was once just as ambulatory on land as, say, sea lions. Given how the modern-day ones are semi-distant relatives of proboscideans.*<br /><br /> * "Lost causes are the best ones worth fighting for."<br /> ---Anonymous (no relation!)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-15654826874846505892012-09-13T20:13:53.734-07:002012-09-13T20:13:53.734-07:00I'm surprised at you for even offering an opin...I'm surprised at you for even offering an opinion without even bothering to look at the object! actually the depiction is the wrong shape for a sirenian, has a moderate length of neck, and has hinder flippers and not a manatee's tail. And it confirms the visual reports of "Sea Monsters" in the same waters which are descrbed as being like elephant seals otherwise. I'm afraid you are fighting for a lost cause trying to explain away the reports any other way. The reports go back at least to the 1920s and 1930s, and they are supported both by tracks and by clear photographs. And the tracks and reports continue around Brazil by way of Marajao Islans to the Southern Atlantic coasts of Brazil, where sea elephant occurances are not disputed at all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-23348153185293770432012-09-13T14:47:25.343-07:002012-09-13T14:47:25.343-07:00Given the relatively recent return of "Chessi... Given the relatively recent return of "Chessie the Manatee" to the waters of Maryland, I'm more inclined to believe the model for the Texan carving might have been a subspecies of Sirenidae slightly more amphibious than modern-day "sea cows."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-53410640110289427642012-08-21T20:38:20.848-07:002012-08-21T20:38:20.848-07:00This is actually a secondary issue, but there is a...This is actually a secondary issue, but there is a series of "Monster" reports which sound as if they are describing Elephant seals from the warmer areas of the North Atlantic, on both sides. And the theory was brought up by Roy Mackal: it only happened to go along with some other "Monster" data that Ivan had collcted but did not connect up. There are several postings that have to do with that matter. Most recently posted I believe there was a little clay model which resembled an elephant seal found in an Archaeological context in Texas.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-70232446263006242462012-08-21T18:56:22.983-07:002012-08-21T18:56:22.983-07:00Personally, I think a stray elephant seal, as bein... Personally, I think a stray elephant seal, as being the "secret identity" of the bunyip, is far more likely than the same creature being the source of those two "monster" sightings in the White River of Arkansas (USA). First, in the 1930's. Then, a second and last time, in the 1960's. <br /><br /> I forget who first postulated that "Whitey" was a nomadic bull sea elephant. The late Ivan Sanderson, maybe. But, there are one or two factors that mitigate against that. First; elephant seals proper only live along the Pacific coast of the Americas and Antarctica. Secondly; while they do have Atlantic-dwelling relatives (the hooded seals), with the same inflatable nose-sac on the part of the males, the latter grow to only about half the size of the former. <br /><br />So, if Whitey really is/was a stray sea elephant, I think it more likely to have been a circus animal that escaped from captivity during winter quartering. And, if born and raised in the Arctic North Pacific at the time it was first captured, it was probably trying to make it back home, the first time it was sighted in that aforementioned Mississippi tributary. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-89526899032215800012012-02-29T15:06:12.969-08:002012-02-29T15:06:12.969-08:00My concern with the reference to 'otters' ...My concern with the reference to 'otters' is that they appear to be from a more modern mammalian line. It may well be that this critter was an 'otter'-like marsupial survivor from the Pleistocene. We are only talking about 10's of thousands of years before modern times. Aboriginal Australians may well have encountered these or as yet undescribed species.<br />I wouldn't rule out the 'seal' pinniped hypothesis, its a long way to the beach from Ararat (ACDC song?) but the Murray Darling system does provide an aquatic corridor & given the water clarity of the system as reported by my grandfather, it wouldn't be impossible for a pinniped to navigate, feed & if it had company, breed. Imagine coming face to face with a sea lion or leopard seal for the first time without any cultural reference to marine mammals.<br />The thing that throughs me is the reference to facial appendages, beaks, claws & feathers. But then again we can see these references being made to 'beach monsters' today that turn out to be soggy, decayed modern mammals wash up on beaches & reported widely by Froteans world wide.<br />Kindest regards,<br />Jeremy HAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-91365684103760203112012-02-28T23:05:52.260-08:002012-02-28T23:05:52.260-08:00Only those things have long, strong legs: the outl...Only those things have long, strong legs: the outline shows more likely flippers, my friend. It is a disproportionate bird or dinosaur but a remarkably accurate tracing of a big seal's outline. And my feeling is that it was meant to be viewed longwise-with-nose-end up rather than long-neck-and-head-down. I know that part is harder to prove but that is my preferred orientation of it.<br /><br />Best Wishes, Dale D.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-86130355320312562542012-02-28T21:23:41.645-08:002012-02-28T21:23:41.645-08:00That makes sense Dale, thanks. I just realized too...That makes sense Dale, thanks. I just realized too, that the outline ALSO vaguely looks like a dinosaur or perhaps a large flightless bird. Depending on of course which end is the head =Dtwas_brillighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06114267855782752142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-81330241187754067522012-02-28T17:50:26.415-08:002012-02-28T17:50:26.415-08:00Oh I know Amazonian Giant otters well enough-otter...Oh I know Amazonian Giant otters well enough-otters are just not supposed to be present in Austraila (or New Zealand either, except the Waitoreke makes a better otter candidate) The theory as mentioned by Heuvelmans and subsequent authors actually is that the Bunyip would be a previously-unsuspected marsupial otter <i>analogue</i> and actually that might go with the smaller series of reports (about 5 feet long) rather than the larger sized series. See the subsequent posting on Beastly Bunyips.<br /><br />In this case that is hardly necessary because the outline in the creek bed is a spot-on exact match for an elephant seal in shape. And an otter would have an extra pair of limbs. The elephant seal would have been approximately 20-25 feet long.<br /><br />Best Wishes, Dale D.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-89235308404106482132012-02-28T16:51:27.561-08:002012-02-28T16:51:27.561-08:00Although I agree, the outlined form does look a lo...Although I agree, the outlined form does look a lot like a seal of some type, but from my understanding, Bunyips may have been a previously extant species of GIANT (and i mean GIANT) river otter. It would best explain the speed, the appearance and potential power and ability to dispatch many humans, especially a pair defending it's young. <br /><br />Giant Amazonian River Otter http://www.naturetrek.co.uk/images/tours/summary/ECU02_sumR.jpg <br /><br />Incidentally, I used to have pair of pet rats named Bunyip and Sasquatch. =)twas_brillighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06114267855782752142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-60999951497882790272012-02-28T14:48:34.260-08:002012-02-28T14:48:34.260-08:00The majority of experts would turn your words arou...The majority of experts would turn your words around and then tell you <b> dog-faced Bunyips<i> ARE </i>SEALS</b><br /><br />Best Wishes, Dale D.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-629061224332673795.post-19683609185751914062012-02-28T12:04:53.678-08:002012-02-28T12:04:53.678-08:00seal me bum -its a dog faced Bunyip .seal me bum -its a dog faced Bunyip .Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com